KX Riders
General => In General... => Topic started by: Rick on February 02, 2004, 10:30:31 AM
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Because of a manufacturing error, I have not been able to find a lighting coil to save my life and the manufacturer does not know when they will make a new batch. Next step, turn to you guys. Does anyone have an old lighting coil laying around they would part with? I have everything else I need but the dang coil.
Rick
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How about Ricky Stator...? Never used the guy, but his ads have been in MX mags for years...
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Nope, tried him too, but thanks for the thought. Manny is checking to see if there are any used coils laying around where he travels, so hopefully I will have a juice to make the light shine soon.
Thanks
Rick
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If your that hard up just spend the extra cash for the E-Line....200watts!
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Hey rick.... i bought one from electrex usa. Installed it but it doesnt seem to work. Is that the one u tried? It looked kind of thick to me. The holes didnt line up but i fixed it with drill bit. (or should we say broke it)
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Yup, the manufacturing error resulted in a lighting coil that was so thick that the flywheel could not be reinstalled. I'm still waiting on an answer from Electrex on when the correct part will be manufactured.
On the extra cash for the 200 Watt unit, don't want to approach this Mrs. with that option yet, as I still have not solved the lighting problem on my son's KX125. Don't want to buy a coil at $189 for a bike I will sell at the end of 2004, so he will probably just be running a rechargable battery on the 125. I'm only looking to help get back to the van if we stay out too late, so the light only needs to work for an hour or so, which is why the rechargable battery might work out just fine. I plan to only run one of the 35 watt bulbs on his system, so should not draw much juice. Now all I need is a suitable sealed battery.
With this post, I was hoping to find someone with a used lighting coil laying around. It appears that my only hope is Manny.
Rick
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Moose and Steahly sell lighting coils for the 500,not sure if there made by Electrex or not.Did you also try Baja Designs?As far as the 125, Steahly has a lighting kit that runs off the coil to run the power jet carb,not real bright but itll get you home.Or get a battery and charger from Wal-Mart that powers the kids rideable plastic toys,12 or 6volt, and rig one up.
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Mikesmith,
Thanks for the update. Unfortunately, all of the KX500 coils are made by Electrex, so they are all bad. You are 100% on the money on the battery, but that is the last resort. However, once I get the lighting coil worked out, I might add a small rechargable battery to provide better lighting at idle.
Also, on the 125, since a power jet carb was not used on the 2002 KX125, the kit that runs off the power jet carb for the KX250 will not work. I tested the CDI on the KX125 last week, and found DC voltage, but only 5 volts. Unfortunatly, I don't believe DC voltage can not be stepped up with a transformer like AC voltage can, so out of luck on using the stock ingition system.
My current thought is to just wind my own lighting coil. I have an old KX500 stator coil and have removed the wire. Tonight, I will rewind the coil with 14 guage solid copper wire, all in the same direction. This should give me DC voltage, but not sure if I will have enough voltage or wattage. As long as the voltage is great than 12 volts, the regulator will control the additional volts, so I just need to get to 12 volts or above. I will probably have to rewind the coil plate a couple of times to get the correct wire length/gauge, and might have to use a diode if I can't get DC voltage.
On the 125, the stator has lots of extra lugs, so once I figure out the wire length and gauge for the 500 I can then just insulate a couple of lugs on the 125 stator and wrap on the wire (again making sure I wrap all the same direction). I'll let everyone know how this experiment turns out, and will keep good notes on wire length and gauge in case someone wants to duplicate the process. If there are any electornics folks out there than can provide some guidance, it would be great. I'm just an old gear head that knows a little about a lot of different things, so not affraid to experiment.
This is the kind of stuff I love.
Rick
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Although I have a lighting coil on my bike (Electrex) I don't have a spare untill I get a newer flywheel and E-line accessories fancy expensive jobbie :(
Untill I get that sorted I still need mine despite the fact that it could'nt power a glow worms arse :roll:
Sorry
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I'll let everyone know how this experiment turns out, and will keep good notes on wire length and gauge in case someone wants to duplicate the process.
As far as I can remember from doing Magnetic particle weld inspection years ago the main thing to get right is the number of turns of wire.
I seem to remember seeing a website with info on winding your own bike coils a while ago so I will see if I can ratch it out and post it on here for you
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Demographic,
I had not thought of looking on the web for rewinding information, but after reading your post, took a look. I found a couple of sites with worthwhile information, so should be headed down the right road now. I will be buying a roll of copper magnet wire tomorrow, and hopefully wraping my coil by the weekend. If it works, I will be wrapping the extra lugs on the 125 so the boy can run his light as well. Also, I will post a new thread just in case anyone is interested in duplicating the process. The only question yet unanswered is should I use 20 gauge or 18 gauge. I have posts with both suggestions, so may end up wrapping the coil twice as a test.
Thanks for the input. Ya gotta love this trial and error stuff. And heck, I'm going to learn something to boot...
Rick
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Im interested in how it turns out.
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I got a rickystator on mine, picked up at his shop. If you can get one its worth the wait.
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It seems that 300 turns would probably be adequate, but I finished off at 314 turns. I also had to use 20 guage wire in order to get enough turns. If I had room, I would have wrapped as many as 340 turns, as I am using a voltage regulater to control spikes. With what I have, I can light a 35 watt halogen without any trouble, but when I connect 2 bulbs for 70 watts, it's pretty dim at idle. I have elected to install a switch so I can change from one light to another in case I have a bulb failure. However, if you purchase a handlebar switch with a high/low setting, you can access two bulbs at higher RPMs, and just one at idle.
This was a real learning experience, but well worth the time. Also, if I had it to do over again, I would not purchase the UFO, but rather the Acerbis plate, as they are better built and worth the extra money. They also have a cover over the lense.
Let me know if you have more questions.
Rick
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Rick, If you have time Id like to read one of your helpful step by step write ups on how you did your lighting coil as Im sure everyone else would to.Thanks.
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Rick..do you need to coat the wrapped wire with electrical varnish??? And rewinging the stator fix a bad stator or weak stator???
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I like to attempt this but have a couple of questions...
1. Where do the supplies come from? Are you only replacing the coil wire itself?
2. Can this process be done to replace/rebuild the regular stator coil..not the lighting?
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Hmmm, renewed interest in making electricity. Gotta love the do-it-yourself attitude on this site. :wink:
The only reason I can see to coat the coil after winding is complete is to keep the wire from vibrating on itself and rubbing off the coating. Since the KX500 has a slight amount of vibration :D , I think you should coat the coil. I visited with a local motor rewind company quite a lot on this issue, and they sent me to Home Depot to purchase two part epoxy that would adhere to plastic. As it turns out, the type of epoxy its not critical, as long as it will bind to the plastic coating on the magnet wire.
As a note, I have removed the stator from the KX125 to try and wind a lighting coil, and the magnet wire on the stock stator IS NOT coated with anything. Since the KX125 stator is built like a circle with lugs on which the wire is wound, I think I can just wrap 20 gauge wire over the top of the stator wire and get enough wraps to ignite a headlight.
On the question of rebuilding the stock stator, most certainly. I used an old stator (it was still in fine shape, but I just didn't need two extras, so I sacrificed it for the lighting coil experiment) and just removed the wire to get to the iron core. When I removed the wire, I found that the stator wire is very small gauge (not sure exactly what gauge, but a motor shop can measure and determine for sure). It also has LOTS of wraps. In order to rewind a stock stator, you will need to match gauge and match the number of wraps. Unfortunately, I'm not really sure how many wraps there are on a stock stator.
If my stator every goes bad, here is how I will proceed. I will measure the width of the wrap with a digital caliper before I remove any wire. I will make an assumption on the thickness of the epoxy, and deduct this amount from my measurement. I would also check the resistence in a stock coil from a friends KX500. Next, I will take the stator to the local motor rewind shop to determine wire gauge, and purchase wire (this stuff is cheap, and the shop I used actually just gave me both 18 gauge and 20 gauge wire on a spool for free. I even tried to pay, but they wouldn't take any money, just wanted me to let them know how it turned out. Cool folks.). I would then wrap the core with enough wire to get really close to the measurement of the old coil. Once the wire is cut, check resistence to make sure you are close. I found that the number of wraps is not an exact science, and getting close seems to be good enough. Based upon my wire removal of a stock stator, I would guess that the stock stator has 1500-2000 wraps, so I will build a little jig to hold the spool and the stator paralell, with a hand crank on the stator. This will help keep tension on the wire as you wrap the core. Once the wire is wrapped, I would install the stator and see if it runs the bike. My guess is that it will work the first time.
Finally, on the lighting coil, this is AC voltage, so will not charge a battery. If you want to run a battery, MOOSE makes a nice little regulator/rectifier that will provide DC voltage. I have thought about running a battery to eliminate the low RPM low light problem, but rechargable batteries are expensive, so just elected to stay with AC voltage as my light is for getting back to the truck at dark, and not for street riding.
Let me know if I can help further. Good luck
Rick
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Thanks for the info Rick!!
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Rick RULES!
This is the kinda discussion you only find amongst us Green-folk.
Now...Rick...how do we build and install an electric strater?
Manny
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I know of a guy who managed to fit an electic starter to his Kawasaki. He worked at Kawasaki though and had "free" access to all of their spairparts. It can be done...
What about an instruction how to convert a KX500 to a trike?
Seriously Rick, thanks for the effort you put in. I admire your stamina and stubbordnes! You do whatever I think about doing (read which I did) and I am impressed.
Thanks,
//John
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Actaully, I've given electric start some thought. All we need is a ring gear on the rotor that will engage a small starter probably in front of the motor. When I get old :wink: , I will have to start giving this some thought. For now, I just rely on my right foot...
Rick
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Parts needed -
Yamaha RXS100 rectifer diode,Moose Voltpack regulator,325 turns of 0.75mm magnet wire wound around a Suzuki X7 lighting coil core,and
a small 1.3A/Hour sealed battery (fits in airbox)
This core has the exact same hole pattern as a kx500 core but takes more windings,so you can use your stator plate to make a template to mount the second core,this has to be fairly exact as you only have about 1mm either way between the inner and outer parts of the flywheel,or kiss goodbye to the lighting coil its just taken an hour to wind.
One end of the coil wire is bolted to the fixings for the core,the other is extended out with flexible cable to the regulator/rectifier.
The fixings for the coil are M4 bolts tapped in to the stator plate from behind,and nuts on the front to space the coil off the plate.The bolt heads on the rear may need filling down so the stator plate fits properly
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Parts needed -
Yamaha RXS100 rectifer diode,Moose Voltpack regulator,325 turns of 0.75mm magnet wire wound around a Suzuki X7 lighting coil core,and
a small 1.3A/Hour sealed battery (fits in airbox)
This core has the exact same hole pattern as a kx500 core but takes more windings,so you can use your stator plate to make a template to mount the second core,this has to be fairly exact as you only have about 1mm either way between the inner and outer parts of the flywheel,or kiss goodbye to the lighting coil its just taken an hour to wind.
One end of the coil wire is bolted to the fixings for the core,the other is extended out with flexible cable to the regulator/rectifier.
The fixings for the coil are M4 bolts tapped in to the stator plate from behind,and nuts on the front to space the coil off the plate.The bolt heads on the rear may need filling down so the stator plate fits properly
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So how many watts do you get out of this set up?You get the parts from a dealer or salvage yard?
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Got all the parts from a salvage yard,you just need to get the guy to let you rumage round in the stuff yourself,you may even find other cores that are the same dimensions,or might let you use thicker wire with the same turns,as for power,im not sure,but it seems ok with 2 25watt halogen spots,a stop and tail light and it manages to keep the battery topped up.Only thing you have to do is make sure you turn the lights on,or it burns up the regulator if your not using all the power its making
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Electrosport in Oceanside advised today they'll have a shipment in this week of the correct units for the KX500.
If they are smaller than the L22 originally shipped, the output will be pretty low, especially at low RPMs.
I don't know who is making these ones for them.
I'll send pictures of the installation when it arrives.
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Well, "B-Minus" for the new coil (L31) :x .
It looked similar to the previous one (L22), and when installed interfered with the flywheel rivets. I measured and it had 0.043" interferance (negative clearance). Called Electrex, and they were surprised to hear this, but when I advised I was going to mill down the stator plate mounting posts, they said "Yeah, that's what we used to do." They didn't have the records on how much they cut, but I cut 0.145" and it fits.
I'll see what kind of output I get while running although from everything I've heard and read, it'll probably be low. I just need enought to work the Baja Kit, but not enough to light up a dark trail.
Barry