KX Riders
Maintenance & Technical => KX250 / KX125 => Topic started by: 1989kawasaki on October 25, 2011, 01:45:00 PM
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so i am changing my springs to the stock setup cause its too stiff now.
so in my box of springs , i have 2 pairs of fork springs , one pair has 48 etched in the top, the other says nothing
any ideas as to what "48" means?
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The springs weight is measured in Kg....the 48 probably is a .48 Kg spring rate. The thicker the metal the stiffer the spring, same size of metal with looser coils (more are between) the stiffer.
Hope this helps,
DoldGuy
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The springs weight is measured in Kg....the 48 probably is a .48 Kg spring rate. The thicker the metal the stiffer the spring, same size of metal with looser coils (more are between) the stiffer.
Hope this helps,
DoldGuy
Thanks. but would .48kg suit a 180lbs rider?
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Working from the iPhone....can't get to the spring chart. By your previous post you have the manual for your bike, what is the stock spring rate? Way back when & many pounds ago, I had the 1988 KX250 & weighed 155lbs, the stock springs were too soft for me & needed stiffening. Have you bled the forks? What oil level are you running in them? Oil weight? These things have a big effect on the "stiffness" of the forks.
In my opinion, the bikes of that era definitely need stiffer springs for today's style of jumps/tracks & have been told the "Big" conventional forks on yours were far superior to the inverted forks in that era. If you go to racetech.com they should have a spring chart that should help too.
DoldGuy
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race techs calc. says the stock rate is .366kg/mm
and for 180lbs they recommend .45kg/mm (use closest available) which is .46
and im sure after the weight gain after putting on all the heavy gear , then i would suit a .48kg rate.
and the stock rear spring would suit me just fine according to the calc. :-D
i do bleed the forks sometimes, 5wt oil, no idea on the level (shop did the seals and oil for me)
so you think .48 is good?
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That's pretty significant over the stock .36, what rate springs are in there now?
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That's pretty significant over the stock .36, what rate springs are in there now?
no idea. but ill guess ill find out soon
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i took some pics
on the left is the .48 springs. i wonder why the others are longer :?
do you know what the pipe and the washers do??
please excuse the mess.. i was out cleaning today making room for bikes
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m537/cat123456789101/PA280001.jpg)
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m537/cat123456789101/PA280002.jpg)
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The tube/pipe should be a spring guide, washers protect the fork caps if memory serves. Those springs do not fit the same set of forks. Check your manual for the free length specs to determine which (if either) fit your forks. The springs on the right are definitely stiffer as you can see the difference in coil length. The forks should have some sag as the rear shock does & with the springs you have there, one would have no sag & the other would have way to much. Get into that manual & start measuring.
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ok so the free length is supposed to be 56cm. and the longer springs are 56cm. shorter ones are 51cm
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Do you think there may be a spacer missing from the shorter springs?
I could swear both my XR and CR both had a small 2-3" spacers that went at the top of the springs to
"Pre-load" them (I'm thinkin')
Tuck\o/
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d**n.. i cant get the fork caps off.. they are rounded off .
what do i do now? is it even possible to fix the rounded top caps? or should i buy the forks off ebay for $35?
some of the damage was there before. i didnt do all that damage. just made it a little worse
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m537/cat123456789101/PA310001.jpg)
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m537/cat123456789101/PA310002.jpg)
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m537/cat123456789101/PA310003.jpg)
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Take out the top triple tree bolts, it clamps down on the fork caps.
DoldGuy
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And use a socket or box end wrench you will do less damage this way.
Bob W
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Take out the top triple tree bolts, it clamps down on the fork caps.
DoldGuy
i tried that.. the wrench just spins around the cap
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24" stillson or equivalent pipe wrench would grab that no doubt
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i just tried that , now i have a real BAD situation on my hands :|
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Make sure you loosen the upper pinch bolts on the upper tripple tree before you try and loosen the fork cap. My guess this was probably not done and this is why
the cap is all messed up.
Serafin
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Make sure you loosen the upper pinch bolts on the upper tripple tree before you try and loosen the fork cap. My guess this was probably not done and this is why
the cap is all messed up.
Serafin
i did do that. i got the right side cap to turn. but when trying to turn the other one....
too bad i cant just go to the kawi dealer and order new caps; they are discontinued. :x
well, a good set of forks on ebay with good caps and lower fork tubes but the inner tubes are rusted and pitted.
no biggie as i can just swap parts over that might be worn in my forks.
will cost $83 shipped.
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/390313156997?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649
or can a machine shop or sumthin machine off the rounded edges and "fix" them?
ill give the shop a call tomorrow if you guys think i should.
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Well ive ordered the forks off ebay....
i got the right side cap to come off but i cant get the left one off, and it got chewed up trying to
my forks do have the preload collar
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m537/cat123456789101/PB060003.jpg)
kind of embarrassed to show this
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m537/cat123456789101/PB060005.jpg)
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it would be so awesome if the forks that i paid $85 for have the race tech gold valves and springs set up to my weight.
its a long shot . but ill keep my fingers crossed
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i finallly got the severely rounded off left fork cap loose after all the banging, sweating and cussing.
and Bad news!
last time i had my fork seals changed by the dealer...
i opened the top of both forks and NO OIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i am pissed. who wouldn't be?
i had to tip the fork almost upside down for a little oil to come out.
before the seal job at the dealer, i open the fork then immediately oil pukes out
what do you think i should say to the dealer?????
the service was done march 20th
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Nothing worse then shelling out hard earned cash for shoddy work.
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Wait a second....
You're telling me not only did they torque the snot out of your caps, they didn't even have any oil in the forks?
I'm sorry kiddo. There is no way of knowing what happened, got in a hurry, went to lunch, got pulled off the job and someone else finished it.. whatever.. there is no way this should have happened...Blaster hit the nail on the head...Arghh..
There are two sayings I have to remember when commenting on something like this....
One is "Those in Glass Houses Shouldn't throw stones"
and another is like it.
"Let he who has no Sin Cast the first Stone" Bottom Line, I have pulled some Real Bonehead moves myself..
No one is perfect, but good grief... Rats... didn't want to get on a soap box...
Your bike is looking Good so far Buddy, Keep up the good work then Ehh! :-D
Take Care,
Tuck\o/
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+1 on Tucks Sayings :-D
If there is no oil in the fork leg, no oil in the fork boot (sign of a blown seal), and the fork cap was that difficult to remove, would make me question whether the tech was able to remove the cap. With that, & if no oil leakage was present, what if he just drained the old oil, cleaned the forks up & sent them out? You would have no signs of a leaking fork seal as there is no oil to leak.
Thru my years I have learned to cherish relationships of people / business that you can trust as they seem to be harder to find (But they are out there!) & I will be glad to share my positive experiences with others.
Keep at them forks & sure you will be happy with the performance & knowledge you will gain! :-D
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Jeez that is terrible, some people have no conscience!
Personally, I would go back to the dealer and tell them how you see it, they deserve to know your anger and what a poor job they have done whether it was accidental or on purpose, its on their head. They could be burning people everyday of the week with work like this and getting away with it.
Either way I hope it gets sorted soon :-)
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I do remember the day i dropped them the forks, and i went over to the shelf to get 2 jugs of 5wt oil and the woman told me to put it back because they have oil "containers" in the back.
and they said the $100 labour charge i paid covers labour and oil
and obviously they LIED
Doldguy,
no, forks have no evidence of oil leaking..ever since the seal job.
and prior to taking the forks in, i opened both caps and dumped out the oil. both legs had oil. and i left the caps finger tight so its easier for the person at the shop.
and i know they did replace the seals cause they gave me the old dirt-covered seals in a baggie.
and i think i said before, last time on the left leg (which was the hard to remove cap side)
i take the cap off then lower the tube slightly then i can see the oil level. this time i lower the tube all the way down till it bottoms, no oil in sight, only a little splash came out when the fork was completely upside down.
i just cant believe ive rode my bike since march 20th with no oil
Andy,
dont worry, i will stir the pot for them.
but i dont really know what to say to them.
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Ye its a bit of a hard one to press them on as its your word against theirs on the oil or lack of it! But its worth pressing them and see what they say, if they are willing to protect their reputation enough, they will use common sense and accept some sort of liability.
Nothing ventured, nothing gained imo
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I got the forks today..
they are in really nice shape besides the rusted tubes and some rub marks on the lower cases
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m537/cat123456789101/PB100007.jpg)
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m537/cat123456789101/PB100005.jpg)
also the new ones seem "tighter" that the old ones if ya know what i mean
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Good news then ay? :-)
How bad are the tubes, and where is the rust? (hopefully it's not on the part of the tube that needs to seal...)
Tuck\o/
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there is flaking and rust in the seal travel area.
no biggie cause i can transfer parts to make one good set of forks :-)
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just got off the phone with my kawi dealer and i asked them if the cost of a fork seal job includes oil and they said NO.
but they said it YES back in april.
i didnt want to sound like an arse at them cause i might have job there in the future :wink:
also i asked them how much to find all the best parts out of both forks and combine the best into one pair of forks
and they said it would take hours to do that. and they said it would be a good idea to replace the bushings and seals etc..
and i also need new steering stem bearings cause the races are pitted.
my rough idea of costs:
forks: $126
bushing kit with seals: $82
steering bearings: $28.99 +tax
labour: around $90
total: $326.
i wonder why it seems to always costs upwards of $300 to fix something :?
i guess the bike is going to be sitting with no front end for a loooong time
not like i am riding anytime soon. Too cold and rainy, ill ride next year so that will give me enough time and
money to properly freshen up the fork and shock
any idea what it costs to service a shock? oil, gas, seals etc...
i cant wait to experience the awesome 1989 KX suspension that this bike is supposed to have. :-D
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On the bushings, I would look at them first, maybe use a caliper to measure for lopsided wear. I thought they should be replaced on a cr500 once so I bought them before I tore into it, lo & behold it didnt really need them. $75 buck or whatever that could have been wasted on gas for riding or something fun anyway. Just a thought
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yes thats a good idea before blowing money away.
but after the years of abuse from the previous owner i bet they are worn.
would a little back and forth play in the fork leg mean worn bushings?