KX Riders
General => Riding Tips & Tricks => Topic started by: alan on October 21, 2003, 01:08:34 PM
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How about some tips on riding with Paddle tires? :roll:
I have never ridden paddles before, what do I need to know? :oops:
Alan :D
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Are you kidding me? You've not used a paddle on that beast yet? :?:
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Use the power to steer the bike, lite on the bars and let the 500 show you why it IS the dune daddy :wink: OH YEAH... You've never felt traction like this...
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Try road tyres on tarmac if you are after traction...
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Are you kidding me? You've not used a paddle on that beast yet? :?:
Not yet! The only area I can use them out here is very small, only good for a test ride! So I have been waiting for Glamis!
Alan :D
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Ahhh, work on shoulder strength. My first time in the dunes on my 500 was awesome but i felt like my shoulders had been pulled out of the sockets the next day :lol:
Sir John, one day very soon I shall have that feeling :wink:
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Looks like I am in big trouble, Paul! :shock: My shoulders feel everytime I ride her! :lol: d**n it could be my age! :o See what you guys have to look forward too! :twisted:
Just Keep Ridden 8)
Alan :D
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HAHAHA no problem, once we get you jumping the Olds double everything else will be a cake walk :wink:
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HAHAHA no problem, once we get you jumping the Olds double everything else will be a cake walk :wink:
RIGHT! :lol:
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Just thought I'd toss that one out there and see if you caught it :wink:
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Just thought I'd toss that one out there and see if you caught it :wink:
You Be Bad! :lol:
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So, How many paddles and what's avail. for a 19"?
BTW, I've never ridden with a paddle, either.
Manny
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Manny, the paddle you are looking for is the King Turbo paddle. I ran that thing when i had a 19" and it's awesome :grin:
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regardless the make of tire, a 500 needs a 10 blade at a minimum, and a 12 would be better! :twisted:
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The drawback to the 19 is that you can only get an 8 blade, the king turbo has the deepest cups.
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560x18 Cheng Shin, Same as Paul I think!
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Thats one BIG BOY paddle tire right there :wink:
560x18 Cheng Shin, Same as Paul I think!
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Thanks for the input. I'll have one ordered!
Manny
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Hey guys! I took the big Green Bitch out to the dunes yesterday and tried out my 560X18 paddles! :D d**n what a rush! I couldn't believe how different it is riding with a paddle. :shock: Its a whole different bike.You guys are right you have to steer with the power from the rear wheel, since the front rarely is in contact with the sand. :shock: And Paul you were right my shoulders are pretty sore today! :oops:
Alan :D
PS here is a couple of pic's! :D She is ready, just need to fabricate a flag mount!
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Hahaha, it's awesome though and thats what really counts ;)
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Try baja designs for a 19" paddle tire with 10 cups.
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I have a 19 inch paddle tire with 12 paddles, i purchased it years ago when I had a 94. I cannot recall who mades it, but it hook up great. In fact I am about to mount it up for a few goes to Little Saraha way out here in OKla
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I run a 12cup VIPER on my KX5, a close friend of mine runs a custom 14cup VIPER on his CR5. Dont forget to drop a tooth on the front sprocket, this will make the bike even more insane in the sand.
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I used to have a 10 paddle, but could only find an 8 paddle recently that I needed quick. At 110 in width I think it is too narrow and not enough paddles. I'm trying to obtain an 18 in. rear wheel to run a FAT 5.30 X 10 paddle min. Believe it or not, there is a big difference in pulling with extra paddles. Also, I take off my O-ring chain and use a standard chain and older sprocket set that I have because sand will eat up the bushings on the O-ring. Make sure the air box is sealed really well. One time, my paddle broke off the rear splash guard protecting the shock and airbox, ate sand and killed the beast WFO racing a Banshee-ugly!
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The only time I've had a paddle come off is when I've run one of those POS Skat-traks with the glued on paddles.
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I searched Dennis Kirk and found (2) two tires w/ 10 paddles for 19" wheels. Both are 110 width and 90 aspect ratio. In stock and go for about $57.
Todd
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whats the best gearing for the sand? stock or higher?
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whats the best gearing for the sand? stock or higher?
14-50 works really well.
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(See Above)...First off, it wasn't a paddle that came off...Hello! But a paddle tire broke my shock splash guard since I send it so far-and at full compression, paddles tend to smack up against the tiny plastic thing -a-majiggy that protects the shock spring and airbox; hence, letting sand fly up into the engine, via the airbox and destroying the piston and cylinder... oh, and locking up the rear tire at about 85 mph. Anyway, Banshee's have a great Yamaha 350 cc twin bred road racing engine based on a very old engine, but the KX 500 will kill it even with just a sand knobby. For sand-if you are willing to send it to the moon, stock gearing works just great. Nothing like a 4th gear dune jump at Glamis!
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I just got my first Paddle tire for my KX. I got it with an entire rim, hub, sprocket, and what have you. So, I can just slip it on. Thinking of using it when it gets muggy and soggy and at a local drag here. I can't wait to try it. It has a Hooker on it, with 10 paddles. Curious what it would be like on the grass? Any thoughts?
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They use them in hill climbs,so why not?
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Anyone ever ridden with a front ribbed tire? If so, what are the pro's and con's?
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Anyone ever ridden with a front ribbed tire? If so, what are the pro's and con's?
I know this is an old post but I thought that I could add some info on the qoute above.
I have always and only used the King's ribbed front sand tire (the matching front tire for the rear King's Turbo Paddle). I have ridden other friends bikes in the sand with nobbies and definately notice a difference. Your specific suspension settings will definately effect any tire you use in the front, especially in the sand. But with all things trying to be equal, the ribbed tire has a few pros and cons.
Pros: It has great curving/cutting characteristics. Holds very nice at 45 degree angles. Does not throw up alot of sand.
Cons: Sometimes will add headshake at speeds over 50 mph in a straight line (not a common riding style in the sand). Sand that has recently been rained on and is drying out, the different textures will be a little more noticeable (i.e. turning on ridge or face and cutting through the dry sand and hooking up on the wet sand will be a bit more dramatic than a nobbie. And the most dangerous, when jumping or doing wheelies, you need to be careful setting the front tire down off angle, you might get tossed off because the tire will hook up.
The cons sound a bit overbearing, but the pros are 4 to 1 in my opinion over them. Most people definately have a hang up on the looks as well (I guess that could also be a con. lolol)
Anyway, hope this helps some people.
FuriouSly
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So? How you like the ribbed front paddle tire Arigato?
Sly
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The ribbed front is the shizzle. I can now corner a lot more agressively and not worry about washing out. I think we have a good idea about the high speed "shakiness". It's different than head-shake. We need to find a good way to balance that front wheel.
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I think you have that wiggle deal down Arigato. I didn't think about the out of balance tire situation, but now that you figured it out it makes sense. Does it over 50 MPH on smooth straight runs... duhhh, out of balance. Not really headshake, but a wiggly vibration in the front. I need to get a new rear tire on the street bike, so I am going to take the front ribbed tire of the KX5 with me so I can have them balance it also. Very excited about the resolution of yet another bug in the system.
Sly
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I rode my KX one time in Glamis after days of rain and I hated them! The one thing I learned was that I will never go to the dunes without all my tire options! Last year at the Coral Pinks I had to change to my paddles from the hole shots on my V700 quad, because it was so fine and dry. :-o :-o :-D :-D
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Alan, Coral Pink sand is soft like no other.....
Sly, let me know who, when and where on the balance thing. Let's get them both done.
Other than the wiggle, that tire carves like a mad ginsu knife!
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Try road tyres on tarmac if you are after traction...
Try knobbies with ice screws on the ice if you want to feel 60 hp GLUED to the surface.......
When you guys run a paddle tire in the sand, does the rear end fishtale a lot when you are getting up to speed (like 40+ mph)?
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When you guys run a paddle tire in the sand, does the rear end fishtale a lot when you are getting up to speed (like 40+ mph)?
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Actually, we get pretty good hook-up once we get going. The tire will spin when starting from standing still.
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Arigato,
Just curious. When you run the ribbed front can you remove your rim lock (not sure if the ribbed tire will spin under braking)? That would make the front wheel balance better and easier to correct. I was noticing the other day how out of balance my knobby front was with the rim lock and tube stem on the same side. Might be what I'm noticing on fire roads at speed. Cam.
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I don't know about removing the rim lock. However, when I spin the fron tire you can see a "wave" effect going on with the way the tire was molded. The rim is true, but the tire moves up and down on one of the ribs. For $30, I guess perfection is out of the question.
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I just got back home from riding at st. anthony's dunes in idaho last night. i rode with a 10 paddle skat trak hooker on the rear and a knobbie on the front. i'm seriously considering the kings three ribbed front for next years dune trip. i am also thinking of cutting a good knobbie so it has only the center and both outside rows of knobs left. that might track really well without the dangerous knifelike hookup after a bad jump. SLY, ARIGATO, any thoughts on that idea? by the way it was an awesome trip. MADDOGGY
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Arigato,
Just curious. When you run the ribbed front can you remove your rim lock (not sure if the ribbed tire will spin under braking)? That would make the front wheel balance better and easier to correct. I was noticing the other day how out of balance my knobby front was with the rim lock and tube stem on the same side. Might be what I'm noticing on fire roads at speed. Cam.
I balance my wheels. Takes about 3-4 ounces of weights to off set the rim lock. Makes a big difference at high speed and if you get out on the street or fire roads. Picture is my KLR650 wheel but I balance the K5 wheels also.
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I am so jealous maddoggy... St. Anthony dunes are the best.
i am also thinking of cutting a good knobbie so it has only the center and both outside rows of knobs left....maddoggy
AMS sand snake is a good alternative to the Kings triple ribbed front tire. A good step to the next level so to speak.
http://www.amstires.com/productDetails.jsp?product_group_id=1921&category_id=1184
I have been too busted up over the last year to actually get my Kings triple ribbed front balanced and tested. Also thinking that I will remove the rim lock like Cam suggested since I run 12 psi anyway for jumping. Then i am going to try and match the tire to the rim and get it balanced. We do ride at 50-70 mph at the dunes at times and the wiggle is a bit un-nerving.
Sly
Here is a pic of the AMS Sand Snake front with a Kings 18" 8 scoop Turbo Paddle rear on my spare dune bike.
(http://www.kxriders.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10799/MTS_CR5_2_Coral_Pink_072306.jpg)
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The very first time I ever road In the sand was on a kx500 with a 10 cup. I drug the rear fender twice In 50 feet and I have been hooked every sense.
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Maddoggy--How was St. A anyway? If you're getting too much hookup with a paddle, Pirelli makes a pretty gnarly sand knobby.
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Arigato, the paddle was great on the rear. the knobbie on the front was not so great. seems like it wanted to grab the ruts and dive around alot. next time ill go with a cut knobbie front or that 3 rib kings tire. we rode monday am. and it was blistering hot 105 temp. clouded over and was great riding that evening. tues. morn was cloudy and awesome riding, rained all afternoon and as you can imagine the riding was amazing tues. eve. tons of traction everywhere and the wind before the storm smoothed it out like glass. all the speed you would ever want to run. had a blast. you and sly are going there pretty soon arent you. ill give you some route tips if you guys want. i found that i could save fuel that way for more riding on the "BIG HILLS". you know what im talkin' about. :wink: MADDOGGY
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I know that I am jumping in late. For a stock 2004 KX500 is a 10 paddle to much?
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No! a 10 isn't to much I run a 12 560X18 and it's a monster!
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I have noticed that several people have switched to an 18'' rim. What are the pro and cons to the 19'' vs the 18''.
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The only reason to go to an 18 is so you can run the monster 560!
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just aim and shoot. the closest similarity i can think of is water skiing once you break the plane and get on top shes smooth sailing remember accelerate going down the dune if not your in for a long day. speed is the key and as everyone knows thats no problem for a five hundy :evil: :evil: :evil:
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you and sly are going there pretty soon arent you....
Hey Dog, been looking through old posts and seen this one. We couldn't get a run back up to St.A. this year due to schedules and $$$.. 700 dollars just in diesel fuel to get the toy hauler up there and back :x To many other commitments to justify a couple thousand for a sand trip. Love those dunes. Arigato, 1alldave, and myself were just talking about St.A. over Turkey at my house this year. We were laughing about how we wished we had a 6th gear... WOT too fun but a bit fast for our first time at those dunes :evil:
Sly
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I know this is an old topic but I'm new.
About 85% of my riding is in Sand (most of which being Glamis). Reading through this thread I wanted to add my 2 cents.
- I do not recommend a stock chain at all in sand, I've seen stock chains stretch instantly and break quite often. Seen them enough to talk everyone in my riding group into DID O ring chains. Sand has not worn out my chain in 3 years of HARD riding.
- The 3 rib razor from tire is one of my favorite additions to the bike when riding in sand. For carving, top speed, picking lines whatever. It did however give me more head shake, which I fixed with a steering damper. . . 5th pinned has never been so smooth.
- Any engine bigger then a 250 needs a 10 cup paddle minimum.
- The Skat trak paddles with the glued on cups are by far the best paddles I've come across. I've run a kings, chen shin, and the skat trak. The added benefit of the skat trak is that it is considerably lighter then ALL of the other paddle tires.
- As for riding in sand, never use your front brake (unless digging in the rear wheel to take a break) and as mentioned before stay on the gas up and down hills. Approach the top of a hill at an angle so you don't end up going straight over a razor back.
- Also while running in 5th gear WOT hit your kill switch for a second or 2 and then release it. This will save your top end on long runs @ high speeds.
- Lastly use spotters on your jumps, I can't tell you how many accidents have been avoided in doing so.
There are just a few riding tips/ tricks etc that I have used over the years.
Hope it helps