KX Riders
Maintenance & Technical => KX500 Original => Topic started by: jcm3 on February 09, 2015, 05:39:14 AM
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I pulled a rookie mistake the last time I washed my bike. lol I bought one of those plastic air filter covers for washing, so I pull the air filter off (so it doesn't get wet), put a shop rag into the air box boot, put on the cover (it doesn't leak much at all, but just in case I don't seal it well), and wash it.
The last time I washed it, I forgot to pull the rag out. I had a hell of a time starting it, then realized the rag was in there. I pulled it out, but the bike was flooded like crazy. So, finally got it started after about 10 kicks with the throttle wide open, and it rode fine.
During the rag issue, I thought maybe a piece had come off the rag or something, so I took the carb off, checked the jets, etc. It was clean.
Yesterday, before changing the oil, I tried to start it. It is usually a two kick starter, even when cold. It's got a fresh engine, Tom Morgan jetting, and always a clean air filter. All of a sudden, after my rookie mistake, it seems like it is taking more throttle when starting.
Does that tend to point to a float level thing, or what do you guys think? This is not my first 500, and I have starting down pat on this bike. Something has definitely changed. It also seems like I get oil in the compartment part of my bike stand, but that is not new. It seems to drip a little bit out of the overflow tubes, and then the gas evaporates and leaves the oil there.
Thanks for any input.
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One more thing. I recently pulled the airbox apart and used rtv to seal it up. But, I've been riding once since I did that and all was well. It didn't start doing this until I tried to start it with a rag in the airbox. :|
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did you check the reeds really good, to be sure there was no pieces of rag stuck in the petals?
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Good call, I will check that. I didn't look down into the reeds.
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not that you wanna hear it, but I think it would be best to pull the reed block right out so you can "really" get a good look, over just "looking down in there"....
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Colder weather means leaner running engine which should make it a bit harder to start..
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not that you wanna hear it, but I think it would be best to pull the reed block right out so you can "really" get a good look, over just "looking down in there"....
Ha ha. Yeah, I really don't feel like pulling it apart, as it's so clean and shiny, and ready for my next riding trip. But, better to be safe than sorry. :-D
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Colder weather means leaner running engine which should make it a bit harder to start..
Good point, but it's been in the high 70's here lately. lol
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Heat wave..... I'm glad I'm up where it's more livable.... Raining and 50 degrees.... :-o
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Heat wave..... I'm glad I'm up where it's more livable.... Raining and 50 degrees.... :-o
I'm checking the compression using a gauge that I just bought off of eBay, and I'm sweating my butt off kicking it over. :lol:
How much do you guys generally warm it up before you check compression? My engine is tight (only 10 hours since the full engine rebuild from Tom Morgan), and I'm not getting the gauge up to 120. That is lower than I got when it was very worn out, although I don't know if I warmed it up as much and I was also using a friend's cheap Harbor Freight gauge.
I took it around the block for about 5 minutes and ran it through the gears, so it's hot.
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not that you wanna hear it, but I think it would be best to pull the reed block right out so you can "really" get a good look, over just "looking down in there"....
Took the carb off (love these old two strokes, that would have been a BEAR on my 2011 YZ450 that I used to have) and removed the reed cage, all looks well. It started better today, but still seemed like I needed to crack the throttle just a tad when I didn't used to have to do that before.
It may be that the floats are off, I'll have to do some adjustments on it and see if it helps. It seems to run great. Thanks for the tip.
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120LB compression?
Ah.... not the best for a new engine.
I checked mine cold and got over 180... but I'd have to see what I recorded for exact numbers.
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120LB compression?
Ah.... not the best for a new engine.
I checked mine cold and got over 180... but I'd have to see what I recorded for exact numbers.
Yeah, not sure if that is because the new tester I got is not working right, or what. I wanted to borrow my buddy's again, but he can't find it. (http://www.thumpertalk.com/public/style_emoticons/default/facepalm.gif) The bike made 135 psi on his tester, and I think might have been on the stock piston and rings after 15 years.
I got one from Wake2Moto off of eBay.
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Yeah, probably a bad read...
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Took the carb off (love these old two strokes, that would have been a BEAR on my 2011 YZ450 that I used to have) and removed the reed cage, all looks well. It started better today, but still seemed like I needed to crack the throttle just a tad when I didn't used to have to do that before.
It may be that the floats are off, I'll have to do some adjustments on it and see if it helps. It seems to run great. Thanks for the tip.
if you say it's running great and starting ok, and providing it's not suckin air some where....I wouldn't worry too much about having to crack the throttle a touch when starting it.
I have to do the same thing with mine when it's cold...and honestly, I prefer it that way. Before I put my new carb on, it would start without having to touch the throttle...and, sometimes if it hadn't been started for a couple weeks, it would idle fairly high the second it lit off, then I'd be scrambling to get to the choke to "feather" it for a few seconds until it settled down...but if it had been running the day before, it would just start and idle normally...a different slide or slight jetting change may have cured this, but I wasn't concerned with it.
Not that you're experiencing any of these issues, but having to crack the throttle can give you some control over how it idles on it's first few seconds of running...because one of the worst things for a cold motor, is to have it rev to the moon :-o
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Took the carb off (love these old two strokes, that would have been a BEAR on my 2011 YZ450 that I used to have) and removed the reed cage, all looks well. It started better today, but still seemed like I needed to crack the throttle just a tad when I didn't used to have to do that before.
It may be that the floats are off, I'll have to do some adjustments on it and see if it helps. It seems to run great. Thanks for the tip.
if you say it's running great and starting ok, and providing it's not suckin air some where....I wouldn't worry too much about having to crack the throttle a touch when starting it.
I have to do the same thing with mine when it's cold...and honestly, I prefer it that way. Before I put my new carb on, it would start without having to touch the throttle...and, sometimes if it hadn't been started for a couple weeks, it would idle fairly high the second it lit off, then I'd be scrambling to get to the choke to "feather" it for a few seconds until it settled down...but if it had been running the day before, it would just start and idle normally...a different slide or slight jetting change may have cured this, but I wasn't concerned with it.
Not that you're experiencing any of these issues, but having to crack the throttle can give you some control over how it idles on it's first few seconds of running...because one of the worst things for a cold motor, is to have it rev to the moon :-o
+1 on the cold engine thing, I hate when Ido some of the local kids top ends break em in for em the whole 9 yards. Then go over to there house with my boy on a 40° morning watch em fire it up and pin it across the yard. Makes me cringe eevery time!! I have the same motor as jcm3 and never had set to idle always had to crack it.
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Mine does this as well but it made me wonder if it is not old crankshaft seals leaking a touch until they warm up a little as I can get the choke completely off and the idle screw does nothing until it warms up just a bit. :-P
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made me wonder if it is not old crankshaft seals leaking a touch until they warm up
that sounds like a great recipe for....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fk1jLoJP6vs :-D
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Just a noob on this forum, but have you tried changing the spark plug? If you flooded it bad, might have fouled the plug.
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Just a noob on this forum, but have you tried changing the spark plug? If you flooded it bad, might have fouled the plug.
Yep, sure did. Thanks for the input.
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made me wonder if it is not old crankshaft seals leaking a touch until they warm up
that sounds like a great recipe for....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fk1jLoJP6vs :-D
Hmmm. When I read what I wrote it does not sound very good... Sounds worse if I say it out loud... Crap.
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Hmmm. When I read what I wrote it does not sound very good... Sounds worse if I say it out loud... Crap.
just so you know Brute, I wasn't trying to trash your post...I've always highly respected your answers/responses, I'm sure you noticed that I didn't disagree with your previous post, because it does make sense....I was just being the wise a$$ that I am, and made a little comedy out of it. :-D
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And here I thought you were trying to say "Hey Dumba$$! Best get that looked at!" :-D
Better now then when it seizes up! I was serious when I said it sounded bad. If someone told me their bike was doing that I would admonish them to fix it or suffer the consequences. Thanks for the wake up! 8-)
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Mine does this as well but it made me wonder if it is not old crankshaft seals leaking a touch until they warm up a little as I can get the choke completely off and the idle screw does nothing until it warms up just a bit. :-P
Wellll, when I wrote this I had done some work on the bike a while ago and had just pulled it out to start/warm it up for a bit with no riding involved. Put it back in the shop and covered it up as I had to get to work. Fast forward months to now and replacing my front tire. Noticed a 'note to self' to check cable routing and hoses. Got the front tire on. Fired it up. All good now. Oops :-D
My first thing to say should have been "Check to be sure the throttle is closing all the way".
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My first thing to say should have been "Check to be sure the throttle is closing all the way".
that sucks!...it happened to me once years ago on a 250....kill switch wouldn't kill it, luckily putting it in gear and slowly letting out the clutch whilst STANDING on the rear brake pedal shut it down.
Since then...I've always listened for that distinct sound of the slide closing.
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Sucks that I missed it the first time. :x Good for me that it is working fine. :lol: Lucky the throttle was just under a little tension instead of 'open' like your 250 was. I would have to imagine there would be some kind of damage done somewhere stopping a 500 with that method. :-o
I always check the throttle 'snap back' before firing up but obviously missed that it was 'not quite' all the way closed at rest or at least under a bit of tension.
I remember I was in a hurry to get it started because I 'had to get going' which is always a recipe for a disaster. 8-)
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yeah I forget what I was doing to mine...but I had the handlebars off, just laying on the front fender with all the controls still attached....
it was because when I re-installed the front #plate, I had the throttle cable OVER the #plate bolt, instead of UNDER it like it's supposed to be, which caused it to be way too tight when the bars were turned :x