KX Riders

General => In General... => Topic started by: musturbo on April 07, 2005, 10:21:16 AM

Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: musturbo on April 07, 2005, 10:21:16 AM: My dealer wants over 1100 to fix my 04. $600 of that is labor. Bike needs a cylinder(or bored and replated) piston kit, gaskets. I called phat head racing and they said $300 for an iron sleeve and full port. THey guarantee the sleeve. Was also going to buy a coated vertex piston . Can you guys give me your thoughts or recommendations please? Total ride time on the bike was 1hour>
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: reknelb on April 07, 2005, 11:22:10 AM: check out Gorr's prices on his web
http://www.eric-gorr.com/Default.htm
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: musturbo on April 07, 2005, 11:40:01 AM: I can't find any prices o his site and got an answering machine when I called. Mac wants $294 for the cylinder and top end kit.
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: John on April 07, 2005, 11:53:17 AM: How damaged is the cylinder? Most of the time it is reparable through welding and re-plating. That's what I am doing with my cylinder now and I am being charged ~?150 for the lot. Not much of damage though. Add another ?120 for the new (Wiseco) piston and ?40 for gaskets and o-rings and stuff. So the complete top-end re-build is approx ?300+. I'll do all the work myself except the welding & plating :wink: .

The cylinder will then be standard 86 mm, no oversized bore.

Sounds a tad expensive what you have been quoted, then again, I don't know how badly damaged the kit is.

//John
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: gowen on April 07, 2005, 02:07:17 PM: $500, for a 520cc big bore, replated, ported to your desire, head mods, and the piston kit/everything. It is worth it![/img][/b]
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: Rick on April 07, 2005, 04:28:33 PM: Call Rick Peterson Motorsports for replating. His shop does the work for almost all of the factory teams, and he has a quick turn around. In fact, if he has a cylinder in stock that fits your bike, he will just swap you, so you can be back riding by the weekend.

On the sleeves, I tried one and will NEVER try another. Lost power, and the bike just plain sucked after the installation. No matter what the warranty, they can't give you your unsleeved cylinder back so you can just do it right and have it replated.

On pistons, just use a ProX or Wiseco piston, and you will be one happy camper.

Rick
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: mikesmith on April 07, 2005, 09:43:55 PM: Maybe your dealer figures the since the oil companys are getting away with screwing the public that he'd give it a try,$1,100.00!Is he out of his mind?Go with the plating and if you can do the job youd save the labor(theres always good help here)and Ive had good luck with Wiesco pistons.Why'd it seize in the first place?
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: John on April 08, 2005, 03:30:53 AM: I am working on a top-end rebuild description together with Doordie. I think it will come in handy for you if you are planning to do this yourself. If you can throw a wrench - you can do this. No special tools are needed, just patience.

ETA a week or two, just missing some of the assembly pieces and some svEnglish. Most of the tweaks and inspection parts are already done including some KIPS fixes (thanks to Doordie).

//John
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: gwcrim on April 08, 2005, 06:02:17 AM: I've been rebuilding dirtbike top ends for nearly 30 years. It's not hard. Don't pay someone to do it for you. If a 15 year old kid and do it, you can too.
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: musturbo on April 08, 2005, 02:29:19 PM: I am picking up the bike sat morning, . I will take a look at the devastation myself and decide if a cylinder , bore and sleeve or replate is the way to go. I was thinking sleeve because I have a reputable local place to send it . I was also thinking it would last longer. Again, I absolutely am thankful for your input. worse case I drop $400 for a cylinder. Best case the sleeve works, my port job produces power. I have a wideband o2 and a data logger I will try on the bike. This time after the break in it is going straight to the the dyno to tun e. I will post pics of the piston and bore tommorow.
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: musturbo on April 08, 2005, 02:42:19 PM: JOHN- please email me that top end description! I think a schematic and torque specs should do it. Just not familiar with the kips assembly. Oh yeah, $131 for diisASSembly. My wife said, "what are you having them do it for, do it yourself.' Should have listened.
Title: cylinder
Post by: musturbo on April 09, 2005, 04:04:39 AM: cyl
Title: piston
Post by: musturbo on April 09, 2005, 04:08:17 AM: score!
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: musturbo on April 09, 2005, 04:11:05 AM: Decided to have lancourt in alabama replate the cylinder and supply a coated pro-x forged piston. While it is apart I am also doing a full port and bringing the compression up a point. Thanks, Guys, will keep everyone posted and will post dyn #'s if interested
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: John on April 09, 2005, 10:07:32 AM: Musturbo,

I have added a post in this forum about the reuild.
See;
http://www.pitbull-racing.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&p=9517#9517

Regards,

//John
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: gowen on April 09, 2005, 04:47:36 PM: That information John and Doordie have provided is a+! Also, I'm sorry to hear about your engine!! That's wierd, I had the same issue. Just a little wose. :-) Good idea to get it replated. Also, pro-x is cast not forged, do you mean Wiseco?
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: mjscore on April 09, 2005, 11:28:32 PM: I'm about ready for a top end on my 500. What is the best piston Wiseco or Pro-X? And cast or forged?
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: gowen on April 10, 2005, 05:43:29 AM: Quote from: mjscore
I'm about ready for a top end on my 500. What is the best piston Wiseco or Pro-X? And cast or forged?

That question has been argued for years. But, I believe that Forged is better. As I've run Wiseco in everything it supports, never had a lockup until last week, which was due to me not shaking the gas can (which had been sitting for a week or so) before I filled my bike. I did at one point put Pro-X into a friends Yamaha Blaster cause it kept seizing wisecos, but a few months later, it fell apart and caused way more damage than the wiseco seizing, it was something else obvisouly. Wiseco is my pick!
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: hughes on April 10, 2005, 12:31:31 PM: Dude. US Chrome quoted me 165.00 + shipping for replate. widwestactioncycle.com has complete top end kits(every gasket and 0-ring needed) you will find in the kit for 126.95. for around 350.00 for parts/plating half day of your labor and you will be riding again.
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: hughes on April 10, 2005, 12:33:42 PM: Quote from: musturbo
Decided to have lancourt in alabama replate the cylinder and supply a coated pro-x forged piston. While it is apart I am also doing a full port and bringing the compression up a point. Thanks, Guys, will keep everyone posted and will post dyn #'s if interested
Musturbo, Who is lancourt :?: and what contact info do you have for them.
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: Timbowe on April 10, 2005, 09:16:30 PM: Wiseco fresh in my 500. Trust them. They are good. And they look nice too. :)
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: reknelb on April 11, 2005, 01:24:57 AM: Cast pistons are better for aircooled 2strokes in my opinion. They dont expand as much as a forged. My rd400 race bike used to sieze all the time with seizeco pistons. Never with the cast pro-x. Modern liquid cooled engines are a different story, pick your favorite and rebuild.
Title: $1,100+ for a toop end?
Post by: musturbo on April 11, 2005, 12:29:11 PM: I will get and post Lancourt info on tues. I was told they do a lot of factory race stuff (yoshimura). British guys in the u.s. Figured I would do the cast on this build and go to forged wiseco when there is some wear. Scott immediately saw the shortcomings of the ports and is cleaning them up now. Total cost(cyl disassembly, top end kit, assembly will be $600.