KX Riders
Maintenance & Technical => KX500 Original => Topic started by: gwcrim on September 18, 2004, 12:54:59 AM
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Heyall. Long time no see. We built a house this year so I've been kinda busy not riding.
I did manage a few outings on the KX. I'm tired of the clutch drag and the shaft on the actuator needs a new seal. Here's my questions:
1) What do you have to go through to change the seal?
2) What do you have to go through to lengthen the arm?
In case anyone wants to see the nuevo casa, there are pics in the Crim Estate folder here: http://photos.yahoo.com/gwcrim
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Very nice casa de gwcrim. Once the post build wreckage is cleared out and the landscaping takes over that place is going to awesome. :worship:
I miss all the green stuff... :sad:
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gwcrim,
Cool House! I just lengthened my arm (clutch) a month ago. Added 5mm, pretty simple. I used to think 10mm was the amount but others warned me it was too much (they were right - as usual). I used a piece cut out of a large 1/2" washer since it was the right thickness. I welded mine with a stick welder - did some thin test pieces first. Makes a noticable diff. You should be able to change the seal while the arm is out (it just rotates and pulls straight up). Cam.
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Thanks for the tip there, Cam. Not as bad a job as I thought. Add it to the winter 'to do' list.
I actually have grass growing all around the shack exept for the very front yard. I need some big time fill. ODOT has been gracious enough to leave me what they dig from the ditches. And that's been a big help. I sure hate the idea of paying for dirt.
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I have this mods for easy clutch pull (like a kx125 cc). 8)
(I`m a lousy photografer,hehe) :oops:
No lengthening the clutch arm needed.
//doordie
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Doordie, you know all the old tricks!Ha!But I dont like how it moves the lever farther out,but if you have long fingers or it suites your style of riding it works great!
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Doordie, come on! You have to practice with that new camera of yours... :wink:
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I tried one of those clutch levers with three spots for the cable end, but it snapped off with the first "little" crash. I have also tried the EZ Clutch sytems with the stock lever, but had to switch to a KX250 cable to get a decent route. I finally switched to the FLY Racing adjustable lever, and that did the trick. I actually had the same lever for about three years, as it has a bearing in the pivot, so I just have to lube once in awhile. While I carry a spare lever in the tool pouch, I've never needed to install it.
Oh yes, I did not have to lengthen the clutch arm with the Fly Lever, so saved some extra work.
Rick
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Pulling the seals and lengthing the arm is fairly simple. The bearings that support that arm are a different story.
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I will use my new green beast for the dessert, so I don't think I need autoclutch unless you do not have to clutch between gears?(does it clutch between gears?/does it shift easier without the clutch than a stock bike?), although you do not have to shift between gears without it if you roll off the gas. I hear you still have the clutch lever you can use? I want to baby this new tranny though. A bro told me that another co.(I forgot the name/doesanyone know the name?) makes an auto clutch also that does not need a wider clutch cover side case as the EFM billett does. I will write both co's for info to see which is best and I need to decide for sure if I want the $500 investment or not before I buy the EZ lever and mod my clutch arm. My clutch is stiff as heck compared to my butter 250 clutch. I thought about changing to 250 springs but scared they can't handle the beast. Does anyone know about the two levers I have found for EZ pull clutches. They are MSR Raptor EZ pull clutch lever and RTC clutch lever $40(I think the FLY is $60). I think both are three position levers(these kits use special levers and you cannot use your stock lever in conjunction I believe). Is the FLY lever a mechanical advantage lever or just a ball bearing lever or both? What pulls easier, the bearing style or mech 3 position levers? I have a feeling I will shine the auto clutch altogether since I don't do any tight trail riding on the beast, and since I love my butter style clutches I will end up with a mechanical three stage lever or FLY first and probably also will extend-weld 5mm onto the clutch arm in conjunction with the EZ lever unless the lever realy works that good?? This is probably my last and best bike so I want it trick. My next post will be along the lines of our dear departed Rocketscienceracing kits which passed away before the 04 beast did-breaks my heart that the greatest things always get the ax while they are pumping out all this four stroke garbage/Friends don't let friends ride four strokes/Darn treehuggers. O well, you know what the masses are-can't wait to blow by them on the beast in the future as they creep silently on their electric offroad-scooters. Great site and thanks for all of your inputs you wonderful big bore 2 stroke Motoheads!
Twist the grip always and take care,
Me
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Forget the 3 position lever(junk)go with the Fly,PC,ASV or works connection on the fly perch and lever as they give better leverage and quick adjust.Lengthen you clutch arm by welding in a 6-8mm extension and you can polish the shaft,reroute the cable (I cant describe how,but I did mine in a more direct way),use a motion pro cable,invest in a cable luber and use it.These are things Ive done for a better pull than most 250's Ive ridden.And Welcome to the best Kawasaki web site!
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Thanks Mike, you are great and fast, and it is the best KX website!
Ty Davis said 5MM, which is small.
Cam said(see post) 10 too much, so he ended up with 5MM.
So, 6-8MM seems long?
I wonder if I could have someone fab me one 8MM long with a second hole at 5MM so I could decide/change to whatever works best?
Question for Cam:what happens when you tried 10MM?(can 10 work with a diff cable etc.)?
I believe you Mike, it's just that 8 is sooo close to 10 when we talk in mm.
I wil prob play it safe with 5, but am tempted to go say 7 or 8 cause I have small hands ans I don't ant beasty clutch to eat my clutch hand.
Sidenote to everyone: I am told Magura in UK makes a Hydraulic clutch like on the stock KTM for around $250, but I was told the feel is weird?
Thanks and keep me posted as I want it right the first time and like butter, and I will take all lof Mikes advice:polishing etc.
Thanks, Me
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GRTSCTT,
I did 5mm with no problem and combined it with Mikes rerouting of the clutch cable. The two together made a noticable difference. My next step would be to put on an aftermarket slippery clutch cable. One thing to remember is that clutch pull is all about leverage. More leverage = easier clutch. Extra leverage can be added at the bar (aftermarket perch) or at the clutch actuation arm (make lever longer). However, since the amount your clutch lever can travel is fixed (ie. pulled in to the bar is max), more leverage (5mm or 10mm clutch-arm extention) means that the clutch shaft rotates a bit less, so the clutch in not dis-engaged as much. This is generally not an issue but if the clutch-arm is extended a large amount the clutch could possibly not dis-engage fully and drag. I have read about those who have done 10mm but not tried it. As a suggestion, since my 5mm is great you could probably go 8-10 mm with no troubles. If you have small hands, you could space the lever closer to the bars (a 1/4" lockwasher over the cable beween the lever & housing works great) but then might want to settle for the 5mm so you don't run out of dis-engagement travel. I am not a fan of dirtbike hydraulic clutches. I ride with a gaggle of orange bikes and they can't modulate the clutch on nasty technical hills like I can and they all stall lots in the really tough spots (I laugh at them orange guys). Hope this helps. Cam.
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I found a guy whos KTM525 went over a cliff out in the middle of nowhere,and after we dragged it out of there his clutch wasnt working.Im sure it got air in the line from hanging upside down,I wouldnt spend my $$ on one.Thanks for the compliments grtsctt!!
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Cam, what happened when you did 10 MM?
Why was it too much/too long?
Thanks
Scotty/grtsctt
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I always use stock cable, and the $100 fly clutch lever with ball bearings on the adjuster and bearings in the lever. My clutch pull rivals the KX125. Super easy, and no clutch arm work.
Rick
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Scott,
I probably wasn't very clear in my explanation. I haven't done the 10mm myself, only read about it as a recommended mod in magazines. I did 5mm, was shooting for 8mm but carried away with the file. I think there is probably lots of room for 10mm. For extra ease use Ricks fly perch and the 10MM. Cam.
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I thought I'd bump this thread up again because I've been thinking. :idea:
Follow along:
The clutch drags. It doesn't seem to want to disengage fully. (This is a common problem on dirt bikes to a degree right?)
If it doesn't like to disengage fully, that means that you need more action on the lever at the engine.
If you lengthen the arm at the engine, you'll have more leverage for a lighter pull. But as a result, you'll have less action in the throw.
If you want to get more throw/action to promote full clutch disengagement, you'd actually want to shorten the lever at the engine. Wouldn't you?
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GWCRIM,
That is exactly correct. Mind you I haven't had a clutch that drags since the old Maico days. It was a good excuse to use on the starting line though. Cam.
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For those with dragging clutches, it is worth noting that if you still have the aluminum clutch plates, this could be the problem. The aluminum plates wear quickly, and as they wear, the fiber plate will leave a ridge on the outside edge that will catch as you try and disengage the clutch. (Hmmmm, not sure that was clear, but chew on it a while, it might sound better after reading it a few times :lol: ). As I have noted in other posts, I immediately replace the aluminum plates with steel plates, so have eliminated this as a problem.
Rick
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My entire clutch, basket to springs to fibers to plates (steel) is only one year old. And I doubt that it has 10 hours on it.
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Can somebody post a picture of how to route the clutch cable and a picture of this lengthened arm? I am having a hard time picturing it. My clutch is very hard to pull in. Thanks.
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Here is picture of how to route the cable for the least amount of friction/resistance. Also, look at the next picture to see how to zip tie the cable to the frame. You do not want the zip tie here too tight, just enough from keeping the cable from moving around and use good zip ties. My method is a brand new OEM cable (Japanese quality at it's finest), the method of routing shown in my picture, and a good lever with a bearing in it such as ASV. I have done this and my lever feels no different than a stock KX250.
The final picture is Destry Abbott's 2004 KX500 with extended clutch arm. Kaw Rider is working on an arm like this and when it's available, I will give it a go since it never hurts to work smarter not harder!
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Thanks Tom. It seems like the metal tube on my clutch cable has a little bit tighter bend than yours does. I'll have to see if I can take some out.
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I just put some aluminum jaws in my vice and made the cable straighter. Just a little at a time, and it will be good to go.
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here is the aluminum clutch arm.
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how could i get one of those for my 250?
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Thanks Kaw rider, you know I'll take one :lol:
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thanks sandblaster.
1989
If your clutch arm for your 250 is the same as the 500 then it will work.
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thanks sandblaster.
1989
If your clutch arm for your 250 is the same as the 500 then it will work.
it looks the same but i dont know if it is the same
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According to the book the clutch arm FITS 90 KX250 and 90-04 KX500.
The 89 kx250 uses one that FITS 88-89 KX250 & KX500.
I looked at pics of both arms and they look very similar (89 kx250 and 90-04 kx500).
I don't have any to measure :-(
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According to the book the clutch arm FITS 90 KX250 and 90-04 KX500.
The 89 kx250 uses one that FITS 88-89 KX250 & KX500.
I looked at pics of both arms and they look very similar (89 kx250 and 90-04 kx500).
I don't have any to measure :-(
awww too bad you dont have one to measure :-( :-(