Author Topic: She's Alive !  (Read 11215 times)

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TaKeN

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #15 on: March 27, 2007, 08:28:38 AM »
I will get a compression tester :)


Its a 1992 btw..

Offline don46

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #16 on: March 27, 2007, 09:09:54 AM »
I would look at jetting, I'm sure you didn't hurt it. The warmer the temp the richer the bike runs.
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TaKeN

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2007, 09:18:23 AM »
Whilst we are on the subject :)


When i checked the bore ( Cylinder )


On the bike, there were markings on the inside of the cylinder about 1/2 an inch wide going down the bore


There were probably about 8 or 6 of these marks all around the 360 degrees of the cylinder where the piston or rings have started to grow ( I assume )  Is this normal ?


The markings are spaced equally all around the inside of the bore. They weren't deep gouges.. just a different colour to the rest of the bore.

Offline blackkx

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #18 on: March 27, 2007, 12:19:37 PM »
  is the bike running hott ? can you touch the cylinder and rad cap when the power failure occurs . but you definatley need to check the compression . 
98 KX250

TaKeN

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #19 on: March 29, 2007, 04:55:54 AM »
Just did a compression test with the throttle wide open,


and i got 105 PSI, this is with the engine stone cold,


Is this good or bad ??


Blackkx - Well, the cylinder and rad are quite warm, not scolding hot but hot enough to make you remove your hand after a few seconds :)

Offline alan

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #20 on: March 29, 2007, 05:30:56 AM »
My book says 109-171 so it is outside the service limits! :-o :-o
« Last Edit: March 29, 2007, 05:33:11 AM by alan »
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Offline hughes

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #21 on: March 29, 2007, 07:51:32 AM »
Just did a compression test with the throttle wide open,


and i got 105 PSI, this is with the engine stone cold,


Is this good or bad ??


Blackkx - Well, the cylinder and rad are quite warm, not scolding hot but hot enough to make you remove your hand after a few seconds :)


Retest with warm engine. Start engine up and get it up to operation temp and retest. Then compare the two readings.
Open Class 2-Stroke Kawasaki KX500
Yamaha 2005 YZ250
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Offline hughes

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #22 on: March 29, 2007, 07:58:29 AM »
Whilst we are on the subject :)


When i checked the bore ( Cylinder )


On the bike, there were markings on the inside of the cylinder about 1/2 an inch wide going down the bore


There were probably about 8 or 6 of these marks all around the 360 degrees of the cylinder where the piston or rings have started to grow ( I assume )  Is this normal ?


The markings are spaced equally all around the inside of the bore. They weren't deep gouges.. just a different colour to the rest of the bore.

Cold seizure? This was after your rebuild right? Can you post some photo's of the piston and cylinder??
« Last Edit: March 29, 2007, 08:05:33 AM by hughes »
Open Class 2-Stroke Kawasaki KX500
Yamaha 2005 YZ250
Richard Hughes
Dirt Hammers - Online Off-Road Journal
hughes@dirthammers.com
http://www.dirthammers.com

TaKeN

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #23 on: March 29, 2007, 08:25:51 AM »
Will retest with a warm engine tommorow.


As for a seizure, i don't think it has seized because the engine never locked up on me or stopped at all.


The marks look like wear marks to me, i will get some pictures up tommorow :)


Yes, this is after a fresh rebuild


Had the cylinder fixed, machined, welded, nicasil plated.

Then i put a new piston and small end bearing in , oh and new base and cylinder head gasket.



The " Marks " as i call them are not realy marks, they are just areas of the cylinder that look a little bit shinier than the other bits :(

« Last Edit: March 29, 2007, 09:01:54 AM by TaKeN »

TaKeN

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #24 on: March 31, 2007, 02:13:12 AM »
Update !

Engine was in pieces after i compression tested it , so i stuck the head back on and stuck some oil down the barrel to seal the ring against the bore a bit better ;)

I got 115 psi this time, ive not tested it warm yet.


Right, so, i remove the head, the exhaust and then the power valve cover. " OH **** " the arm with moves the power valve control shaft out has somehow jumped off :| , so the power valve hasn't been opening.

Is this why i was getting missfires ?


" Oh well, i might aswell remove the jug now whilst i'm here "


Here are the pictures that i would LOVE for you guys to have a look at and comment on, its currently 10 minutes past 3pm here and its realy sunny :)


http://images.filecloud.com/404622/New%20Nicasil%20Plate%20--%20Possible%20Damage%20001.jpg


http://images.filecloud.com/404623/New%20Nicasil%20Plate%20--%20Possible%20Damage%20002.jpg


http://images.filecloud.com/404624/New%20Nicasil%20Plate%20--%20Possible%20Damage%20003.jpg


http://images.filecloud.com/404625/New%20Nicasil%20Plate%20--%20Possible%20Damage%20005.jpg


http://images.filecloud.com/404626/New%20Nicasil%20Plate%20--%20Possible%20Damage%20007.jpg


http://images.filecloud.com/404629/New%20Nicasil%20Plate%20--%20Possible%20Damage%20008.jpg


http://images.filecloud.com/404630/New%20Nicasil%20Plate%20--%20Possible%20Damage%20009.jpg


http://images.filecloud.com/404631/New%20Nicasil%20Plate%20--%20Possible%20Damage%20012.jpg


These are big pictures, so they might take a while to load ;)


Please be honest with me and tell me whether it needs replating again or not, the piston appears to be ok :)


If you need any more pics please ask, but i would like to put the bike back together tommorow so i can have a good ride :)

Thanks again for all your help so far gents, i realy appreciate it.

Offline FuriouSly

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #25 on: March 31, 2007, 09:42:46 AM »
Well, I am not a motor head by any means so this is mostly my opinion and to stir the thoughts of the pony builders here.  This is a 250?

Your power valve not working will make no top end (WOT) if it is closed.  Not good for breaking a motor in.  You basically are cutting the flow in half...  250 a 125 at top end.

Your compression reading will be, of course, at TDC of the stroke.  It looks like your ring is not seated correctly at the top of the cylinder.  The marks of the piston/rings on the cylinder wall need to be the full length.  It looks like yours are mostly on the top of the cylinder and quite uneven for the work you had done.

This brings a couple thoughts.

First:  Improper bore size.  Kinda looks to be a bit too big.  The picture of your piston shows that the piston above the ring is sliding against the cylinder wall.  If it is too big of a bore you can't get the piston/ring to expand enough to seat the ring properly.

Second:  Is this a cast aluminum piston (like stock) or a forged aluminum piston?  If this is a cast aluminum piston in a bore set for a forged aluminum piston it won't work.  The cast piston does not expand under heat to the diameter a forged piston would,  so it would stay sloppy and not give good compression with the resulting slop through all temperature ranges.  Forged pistons are quality parts but need more warm up time before heavy operation. This gets the piston to full expansion and compression.

A solution?  Well,  did you get the cylinder repaired,  bored,  sealed, and the piston/ring from the same place?  Did the machinist have the piston and ring on hand to do the bore?

Might want to get another ring,  hone the cylinder, and redo the break in.  Don't play around with an "easy" ring setting.  Set it like you mean it.

Warm up to op temp (about 2-4 mins) at idle (not riding it) with little blips to keep it from dying.  Let cool down completely (30 mins or more),  and repeat once.  Then take it to a riding place where you can really work it.  If your skills are not up to the task,  let an experienced rider set it for you.  Anyway,  start the bike and let it warm up a bit (2 mins).  Get out to an area after it is warmed up and that you can put it under a load and get though all the gears.  Now your motor will have about 10 mins of run time that will clean up the edges on the ports and get the ring settled in.  GET ON IT!!!  Ride it like you stole it!!!  Run it up some hills to get a gravity load on it will help it alot more than just flat straight runs across a field.  I break my bikes in at the dunes and that is a load,  sets the ring like a champ.

Anyway,  I am not a motor builder or an expert so this is my opinion on the break in and your motor.  Come on you piston guys,  what does this cylinder look like to you?

Sly
« Last Edit: March 31, 2007, 10:14:09 AM by FuriouSly »

TaKeN

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Re: She's Alive !
« Reply #26 on: March 31, 2007, 10:03:38 AM »
Thankyou Sly, I am very grateful for your reply :)


Its a Pro-x piston, in a 125cc Cylinder thats just been remachined, welded and nicasiled.

The bike is a 1992 model - Engine Number KX125JE098791 ( I don't actually know if it is a 1992 )


All the bits came from the same place, Stan Stephens 2 Stroke Specialists.

** BUMP ** Please reply guys, i want to put the bike back together A.S.A.P !!


« Last Edit: April 02, 2007, 01:14:20 AM by TaKeN »